Grace Community Church

When Dave Desforge was named the pastor of Grace Community Church, the elders put in his contract that he was to take a sabbatical every seven years. It has been nine years since his last sabbatical. “You can always find good reasons not to take a sabbatical,” Dave says. As Dave prepares to take a 4-month sabbatical starting April 1 (recently extended from March 1), the leadership has learned an even better reason to make certain it happens: The Gospel moving out in loving relationship.

You may post a comment, concern, or question at the end of this article by clicking on “comment.” Dave or Josiah will post answers.

Q: Why a sabbatical now?

Dave: The elders set it up in my contract that I was supposed to take a sabbatical every seven years. That was supposed to happen two years ago, but it didn’t work out. I really wasn’t planning to do it now. It just seemed like it wasn’t going to happen. About nine months ago, Josiah began to encourage me not to take it off the table. Since that time, it has taken us that long to try to figure out – can we really do it and, if so, how? The elders have been a big part of that discussion. They have designated two elders to work specifically with me on it. There is actually a set of goals and steps they have worked up for me to encourage and guide me as well as hold me accountable while I’m on sabbatical.

Josiah: First it’s part of what the church has wanted for Dave for a long time. And as I’ve gotten my feet under me, I feel like I can keep things afloat. David Key came on board about 18 months ago as Director of Ministries - working to head up the staff - and the same was true with him. We feel we have enough grasp of things now that Dave can take his sabbatical with some confidence. So the idea of the sabbatical became more of a possibility. We really appreciate Dave waiting for the right time so that we knew the staff was cared for, that the church was no longer feeling stuck, and that we really are moving and we have more people pulling in the same direction in a coordinated way than we have ever had before.

Q: What were the main issues you had to work through?

Josiah: First, it really took Dave and me about 18 months or a couple of years to really begin pulling together. We have always been compatible in how we work together, but just in terms of figuring out how to do that in the context of how the church functions. It has taken two years for me to get on board and to learn everything well enough to where I was as engaged as Dave always has been. Second, David Key has faced the same process since he came on to help lead staff. His impact has really been enormous for the church. He is leading the staff toward a unified ministry plan to help us communicate across the ministries and throughout the church. His work has given us a much more solid feel in terms of the direction of ministries so that it doesn’t rest with a single person. And third, the staff is now developing that unified ministry plan. Although it’s not yet ready to be rolled out to the body, the leadership can see real progress and direction. All those things combined have given Dave confidence he could step away and take a sabbatical. Obviously, it’s not that he won’t be missed but it’s also true that the church is not as reliant on one person as it was three years ago.

Dave: Josiah is right on target. But there are a couple of others things I would add. First, we now have more of a community of preaching. People are most familiar with my role as a preacher. Of course, we now have Josiah preaching in one of his roles as co-pastor. And it has taken Josiah awhile to get his preaching legs back because it is real different than what he did on the mission field. But now he is ready and up for more. But we also have other guys who can plug in. We are just in a better spot when it comes to preachers. The other thing I would add is the development of the multi-congregational model. We just started developing that plan two years ago. And this has been our plan for getting unstuck and the plan for moving ahead and expansion. A lot of that has been David Key and Josiah working with leadership and staff, and it has a lot more feet to it and we have a much better sense of where we are going, when we are going to do it, and how. That helped see the possibilities of taking this sabbatical as well as the timing.

But I would also add that there is never a good time for a sabbatical, which is why it hardly ever happens. You could always say, ‘Oh, this is not a good time.’ We have wrestled with that. I think I would not have done it just because I can always keep coming up with good reasons not to do it. So, it has been through the encouragement of Josiah, David and the elders telling me, ‘No, you can and should take a sabbatical.’

Q. At the same time, would you agree the church is in the middle of some major transitions. Is that why you hesitated to take the sabbatical?

Dave: Again, I think you could always argue there is never a good time for a sabbatical. But I think it is the best possible time - partly because of the season. We’ve thought through this quite a bit. Now is definitely better because I will be back at the beginning of the summer, so I can gear up for a new ministry year in the fall. It’s a good time in my life. Josiah has been able to cut back on his travel for this period so it’s good that way. You can always make arguments it’s not a good time organizationally or strategically or schedule or whatever. But what I would remind our people about are the core realities that define us as a church – the Gospel and relationship. Those are the realities that guide whatever we do, and it is true of this sabbatical as well. I think what leadership has been saying to me is, ‘What’s important is the Gospel in your life, Dave, and you really need this time. If you’re going through the next phase, you need a good way of getting hold of that in your own life and growing that in your own way. Take time and focus and rest.’ So, it’s about relationship. They are telling me that they care about me and that the health of the relationship comes before getting all the work done. I really appreciate that. And from my side of it, it’s saying the same thing. It’s saying the Gospel relationship is really important. It’s an understanding that I’m not indispensable. If I believe the Gospel, then I have to believe that I’m not indispensable. If this is about relationship, I need to trust these other people.

Josiah: The timing issue has been one we’ve thought a lot about. I’m convinced we’ve got the best timing possible. It’s not forced; it’s not quick; it’s not accidental. One of the reasons it’s already been delayed two years was because we have been looking for the right time and way. It’s been nine months since Dave and I began planning it. Since that planning was done privately, the idea may surprise some folks. But we were looking for the best time and way to keep the Session’s promise to Dave. I also believe people tend to misunderstand a sabbatical. It’s often looked at as a complete disengagement from all things related to ministry, but let me clarify. Although it is indeed a slowing down or separation from ordinary administrative, fund raising, and preaching work, Dave will still be engaged in some critical ministry activities. I’m hopeful Dave will find some time to actually study and get ahead, work out some new ideas that he just can’t do if he’s swamped day in and day out just keeping up. Secondly, he’s been asked to make some outlines of coursework or book work. We don’t expect him to come out of this with fully formed curriculum or a book, but it’s a good time to take the next steps and lay the base for what he could do in the future. That will profit the work of the church directly. So there really are strategic reasons to give men whose work requires study and reflection blocks of time to do that when they’re not hampered or distracted by daily stuff. This is work that needs time for full contemplation.

Dave: We have also wrestled about the length of the sabbatical, whether it should be three months or four months. And how much of it should be disengagement and how much of it should be continuing to have responsibility and contact. Where we’ve landed leans toward separation but retaining a lot of responsibilities and duties. I’ll still meet regularly with David Key and Josiah; we’re going to maintain a few personal friendships; and I still have two or three major areas of responsibilities for the church. That’s why it’s four months instead of three.

Q: Is there a biblical basis for a sabbatical?

Dave: Josiah is right; sabbatical is misunderstood because people aren’t really familiar with it. Usually, if they have knowledge of it, it’s in academic circles in order to publish and keep your job. Biblically, the word comes from Sabbath (rest). I believe the cycle of rest is built into the fabric of creation. In Israel, they had years of jubilee and they had regular times for liberation and rest. The whole point in Sabbath is a change of pace, a change in preoccupation, a focus on spiritual matters in your own life. The same thing is true of Sabbatical, but it’s a more extended time to do that. It is true in my life there are literally a hundred things I’d like to read or study. I have stacks of books I’d like to get to but I just don’t have time. There are topics I’d love to explore more deeply but take a lot of focus and time.

Q: Josiah, how do you see this as speaking the Gospel into Dave’s life?

Josiah: There has been a shift in perspective and motivation over the last nine months. The reasons we were originally thinking about giving Dave a sabbatical is that he was tired. But that’s not true now. What has happened over the last nine months is that Dave has really been energized. Dave has felt some of the weight of ministry lifted by David Key and I. So during the time we were contemplating the sabbatical, the reasons shifted. When we first started thinking about the idea, it was like, ‘Golly this guy is really tired and needs a break.’ That may have been the dominant chord last May, but it is not the dominant one now. It’s much more strategic now. I would like to emphasize, though, that the pastorate does take a toll on a person. It takes a toll on the family, and it takes a toll on a marriage. It’s very different from other work; it’s just not the same, because the family is always involved in some way. It’s not that Dave and Maggie are struggling, but golly it would be nice for them to be able to disengage without this background noise. We want to be able to care for them that way. We want him to come back with renewed energy for ministry that will result in greater production. So those are the relational bits that caught our attention now as opposed to nine months ago. Nine months ago, Dave was really, ahh …

Dave: Fried.

Josiah: Yeah, he really was. He felt kind of crispy around the edges, and I was worried about it.

Q: And I think our people are also concerned about Dave being burned out. They know to some degree that Dave and his family have had to deal with a series of deaths and illnesses and hardships. Some of them may even be concerned that this sabbatical may be a transitional step to getting out of the ministry altogether. How do you reassure them that’s not the case?

Josiah: If you would have asked me that question last May, I’m not sure I could have made a strong case. I couldn’t have said you don’t need to worry about that, just because of where Dave was at then. But that’s really not where Dave is now. And we need to make sure we communicate very well that the partnership is working; that I’m committed to it and Dave is committed to it. In fact one of the main reasons the Session has had to argue with Dave to take this sabbatical is that Dave is now saying, ‘Things are going so well, I don’t want to step out right now. I really am excited about what is going on, and I haven’t been this excited for a long time. And now that the excitement is coming back, I hate to disengage at this time.’ So David Key and I have had to say to him, ‘No this is a good time – so let’s plan it at a time where you don’t miss anything critical and keep enough connections so you are not left out.’ So those have been the main concerns on the last four or five months is to work out the logistics.

Dave: It’s true that the last five or six years have been particularly hard, and the last three have been even harder. I think there is a spiritual warfare element to it. I think some of it is just normal life and I don’t feel like we have suffered anymore than most people. It’s all relative. But I do think there are a lot of responsibilities and pressures that come with being a pastor that are unique. One of the things about ministry that is really different – especially in a church like this where there is an openness to being less than OK – is that you are not only aware or your own pain and suffering, but everybody else’s also. So I think the dark parts of life tend to be pretty prominent in these kinds of situations. That does become really wearisome. When Josiah came on, I think both of us had been through a lot. Part of what God used in His providence was to bring us together. We were both ready for a partner and a friend. That’s been huge. Part of what was hard for me before Josiah came on board was not just personal, but professional. We were stuck organizationally as a church. Part of that was I didn’t have the energy or the ability to lead us out of that. And that’s hard; that wears on you. And I think we have already answered how that has changed. The last nine months have been increasingly helpful. As soon as Josiah came on that first week, I felt a burdened lifted or shared, and it has continued to get better ever since. Just not preaching so much has been a huge help. Just like yesterday. Maggie and I came and we found ourselves much more able just to come and talk with people. We are moving about, just meeting and enjoying people. I can really worship without anything else on my mind and receive the fruit of Josiah’s preaching and be encouraged by that. Over the last nine months, I have not had the pressure of being at every meeting, not being responsible for all the staff, and not keeping track of everything. It has made a difference and all the more difference as each month has gone by. So I would like to say that I’m not totally unfried, but with each month it gets much better. I really believe that a sabbatical right now will continue that healing in a huge way. But, at the same time, I don’t think that’s the primary reason for the sabbatical. I know our people may have some concern in that direction but it will be a misunderstanding if they think that is the primary reason for my sabbatical.

Josiah: There are a couple of things unique about this church that may make it more difficult to communicate this. Our people tend to be set up to hear about struggles. So the temptation would be to make this about a struggle. I don’t think that this is what this is about. So I think sounding that note and being honest with it – yeah, we have been honest about struggles and we would be honest if that was going on – but can we be honest and say, ‘That’s really not the story line,’ even if that’s a story line we are comfortable with? As a matter of fact concerning Dave’s leadership, energy, inspiration, encouragement about the future of this church, I’ve never seen those any stronger. So it’s not about, he’s about to go under let’s get him some time, it’s about, we’ve got a huge push coming – he’s overdue for some time away – let’s give it to him so when he returns he has even more energy. So I think it’s a great time to do this.

Dave: That’s why I’m not going to a house on the beach and read novels. I’ve got a whole list of assignments.

Josiah: He has two pages of very detailed assignments that he will be carrying out for the church. So this is not disappearing, disconnecting from ministry or going away to see if he still wants to be a pastor. None of that is going on. We need to clearly address that with people.

Dave: I’m not even scheduling to preach or teach at other places. If I do, it will be a special thing and I will get permission from the elders. We are selling our house, and it’s not to go someplace else. We are looking to move closer to the church. Why would we be doing that if we are not planning to be here? As far as going to another ministry, it’s too scary out there. I mean I’m not afraid of doing bold things, but I don’t want to do stupid things. Finding another leadership, another staff, another group of people that I would be doing the kind of stuff we are talking about doing here, I can’t even imagine that. I can’t imagine finding somebody else I could co-pastor with without driving me crazy. I don’t know of anyplace where we could do multi-congregation with the relational kind of emphasis we are talking about. It’s just not going to happen.

Q: The one twist in all of this is the co-pastor relationship. How will a sabbatical affect that leadership?

Josiah: Good question! (laughter)

Dave: We’ve not done this before.

Josiah: I would say we’re not nervous about it. We’ll work it out. I respect, appreciate, and enjoy Dave’s ministry. My goal in life is not to replace Dave, but to work with Dave. And I feel that same commitment from David. I believe anything that portends toward a large shift in direction then Dave will be involved in that decision. We have picked a time where we don’t believe that will happen because all of those things we have already talked through, but if something big did come up, of course, Dave will be consulted and part of that decision.

Q: How will your job change, Josiah, during Dave’s sabbatical?

Josiah: A lot of my time has been spent trying to bolster, reform and redirect the (foreign) missions of the church. I have also spent a lot of time with staff and on staff issues. Both of those will take more of a backseat during the next few months. I will be preaching more often. I will not be preaching exclusively. We will have Scott, Brian, and others coming in to help carry that load. We do want to keep multiple voices going in Dave’s absence.

Dave: And the upside to that is there will be more opportunities for others to speak, and that will be helpful to them and to the congregation.

Q: I believe the congregation has greatly appreciated what Josiah has brought to this church, but you are the founding pastor, Dave. How do you think our people will react to you being gone for four months?

Dave: I think they will react just fine. There will be concerns. When we went to the co-pastor model, there were some concerns then too. But the congregation was fine. It’s gone really well. I see the changes. Now we meet people at Ingles that say, ‘Hey, you’re a pastor and we like the other guy better.’ It’s taken a while, but it’s been really healthy. It’s taken Josiah two years to get his head around it as much as he has. But it’s taken some time for the congregation too; they’ve grown more and more in appreciation of the Bancrofts. So, I see that’s going to continue. You give that another year or two and it will be less and less about the Desforges. It’s changing. My leaving for 4 months is going to push that even further. Church and preaching in particular is often too personality driven. One reason I feel better is that pressure is a lot less on me, and a lot healthier in the direction we are moving.

Josiah: One of the concerns I have is that Dave has access but not weight. The reason I say it that way is that I know if Dave was completely cut off from things that wouldn’t be a rest but would be a sentence. So part of what the committee will do is to help him and help me stay appropriately connected but to give him a break. While he’s gone I would so I appreciate people’s prayer and their engagement with us and their understanding and my picking up a piece I haven’t done before, a new role. I think I’m appropriately concerned about it, not worried about it or losing sleep over it. Dave has laid a good foundation; we have a good staff; we’re in a good place. I’m not running scared, but it’s a big enough shift that I’m asking for prayer.

Q: What is your hope for the church as Dave takes this sabbatical?

Josiah: I would hope they’d see a demonstration of the things we talk about in terms of shared leadership, trust and affection, and a community of interpretation. They’ll see that this is not one strong guy at the top, there’s a leadership community that God has pulled together and equipped to do this ministry in a relational way.

Dave: I think this requires a broad trust of the congregation. We trust that they trust us. I can’t imagine too many places that would try to do some of things we’ve been doing if you didn’t have a sense of faith in the people that they are going to respond. They might wrestle but they’ll come around; they will be submissive and trustful and that relationship is something we’re counting on. I couldn’t be more proud. We are so aware of our weaknesses and the weaknesses of the church, but I think we’re really proud of what the Lord has done here and how the people respond to the leadership.

Q: What kind of response do you expect from the congregation?

Dave: Trust the Lord and trust and support Josiah and the other leaders as much as I do and will.

Josiah: I don’t sense the congregation is in a place that people are going to run scared because Dave is gone for four months. There are some new folks that have come in and had tough experiences in other places. They may have experienced some coups done inside a church and politics. It’d be real easy to read some of that bad history into what’s a positive, supportive, well-planned good step forward. The folks that have been here a while, I think, have a native feel for that. They may be a little nervous, but the new folks who have some baggage perhaps might worry and see a palace coup. But that couldn’t be any further away from the truth!

Dave: And that is where we are well served by our values. We want our people to express their concerns honestly. If you have questions or concerns please express them and we’ll address them and hopefully we’ll move on from there.

Josiah: I’d like to give a caution. Taking a little information and speculating by yourself doesn’t usually lead to understanding. The doors are wide open for your concerns. If you have a question, please express it. This information is presented as blog, so you can do just that. Or feel free to take Dave or me aside and express your concern. We are welcome to do any of that. That would be more productive than the gossip and the talk and speculation. So, we want those doors wide open.